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[Applause] so what has happened is that uh a lot of

people have contacted me because i think they're free to ask you questions

i mean um would you again sort of tell us

why we should be listening to you what is your background and your

credentials yeah well the

the answer would not be really that they should listen to me

i've studied 10 for 10 years as a matter of fact you see while you

were working working hard for most of your life i'm not 47 for most of my life i didn't

work hard not in that sense i work in factories chemical industry germany whatever but i

i know what work is but

most of the time instead of working i was reading

if i had a better memory then i would be uh much closer to perfection as far as

mythology is concerned but i have done my studies at the angelico

monroe but that's not the point that's a high school sort of high school outfit

pretty low level as far as the academic level is concerned but i had the luck of

having some of the old teachers who introduced me to saint thomas in the proper way

and once introduced to saint thomas i started to instead of studying the most of the time

modernist books most of the teachers of the angelico wanted me to read i just spent my spare time and i spent

i also spent my studying time with uh the writings of saint thomas and

the famous book which is called dancing the collection of paper magisterium in

latin that's a book that i'm studying now for 25 years that's the reason why there are certain

things that i really know and at the same time i hope at least i've not lost my common sense and

the reason why i say you're not listening to me but to the church teaching as much as i

can remember it now there's young people out there who will remember certain things much

better than i do at the same time many people have not learned the theological

method that's not only common sense it's also that you will never have all the answers

ready all the time see we are doing a sort of live

interview here and i have not been prepared for this i don't even know what your questions are going to be but you may rest assured that whenever

you face me with a question that i do not have the answer for i will not give an answer i will not give you a substitute

for an answer one of the things today that is thoroughly misunderstood

also among traditionalists is that to think that who has the better argument

has the truth that's not true that's what people may think about some

idiotic tv discussions between presidential candidates

they might think that the one presidential candidate that has the better arguments

and has better apparently the better reasoning and the better preparation must be the better man but that's not

true because in public discussions very often

the purpose of the discussion is that i am right not to find out the truth the reason why

i can answer your question why should people listen to me in the first place is that i will always try to the best of

my knowledge to reproduce doctrine that is traditional with the church one

of the reasons why i'm not in all too familiar and good terms with the consumer church is

because they want they would want me to call back into and after having stopped quoting vatican

to cool paul vi and john paul ii and you're highly embarrassed when you came up when you come up with quotations

that are uh from the council of trent or pope fires to tense and that proves

them wrong because they're not interested in the truth most of the time they defend a certain political purpose or they just

want to be right and unfortunately among traditionalists it's a widespread phenomenon

that many priests just want to be right they want to be able to say see i was right and you were wrong

i've never been interested if i was right i'm interested in what is the truth what

is correct what is right and the reason why uh i would never say

you should listen to me but the reason why there could be much worse things you could do than listening to me

is because at least i i try my very best not to make up things

i try to give quotations as much as my memory permits me to do so the reason

why i'm not sitting here with a prepared manuscript that will read to you is because it would be

useless latest on page two you will be honestly asleep well you said

we have not you don't know the questions i'm going to ask you no i have no idea why the point is the

point that i have to make a point about this one of the reasons why i decided to do interviews like this live and not

with prepared questions and prepared answers and prepared manuscripts

god has given his talents freely he gives them

individually to each individual he gives them differently to each individual

somebody might be much better in reading than in talking freely some other person

might be a lot more gifted for talking freely i happen to know and it's not my marriage because i didn't buy that

i didn't work for that it has to be given to me i have i have the merit that when i talk

freely people stay awake when i read the book to you people fall asleep

the best sermon the best sermon in history

and you cannot challenge me on that but you will see the best sermon in history is christ's

speech to the apostles the last supper recorded in the gospel

of saint john reed by the way talk about spiritually

that's spiritual read of what our lord jesus christ had to say

to the apostles at the last judgment

what christ says here is an infinite value of absolutely infinite value and i

consider it from all aspects the literary aspect not just talking about theology or revelation as a matter of fact what it

is uh the revelation of god's will and god's thoughts and god's intentions

i also consider it the most beautiful speech ever done from the literary viewpoint

however might be a lot in itself where it has infinite value by circumstance it

becomes it can be can by circumstances it can become worthless

namely when uh at night you come home from your work you sit

down you're tired but you want to do something for your spiritual life and here's this guy in front of the

camera and he's reading the gospel to you and he goes on [Music]

you will be solid asleep after the third line of our lord jesus christ old words

so that's what you call delivery to deliver something and i just can't i

i'd rather risk a wrong quotation

but before i read something to you with scientifically researched fixed quotations that will put you sleep

solidly you were you were reared in the

new church yes when did you decide when you wrapped

that altar with the new master i cannot do this anymore a few months after i was obtained and mind you

there's one thing i have to say about that i've never celebrated one single mass

in the vernacular i started out from the very beginning

in 1976 i started to say the the new bravery

the liturgy of horrors and eras instead of ours but i did it in latin

one of the reasons why i needed several years to find out that it's no good is because i did it in latin

not that i don't understand that and that's not the point but once you are faced with translations

of the new bravery in english you will understand why i say if i had done it in english from the

very beginning or in german i would have stopped very soon because i would have seen the blasphemies that come about in the

translations in the latin original usually they find them are you saying to me father

that the to say the new mass in latin from back into and would

would be a valid mass at that point i firmly believe so okay for the simple reason that

uh you cannot necessarily talk about the new sacraments i'm talking

about all the seven sacraments in the new right you cannot necessarily call them latin

right as a matter of fact i'm firmly convinced that they might be all kinds of things but they cannot be of

the latin right there is the point is the latin was more than one

right now traditionally in the latin church you have the roman

right which basically is nothing else but the right that used to be celebrated in the

roman courier and that popeye's the fifth in 1570 canalized

you have the ambrosian right which is pretty similar the dominican riot which is pretty

similar but then you have the uh you have to write the baraka and portugal you have the primos detention right you

have the the right of the uh carthusians whose founder we celebrate today

saint bruno for apollo novice and we have uh the moss arabic lisi gothic right

which is celebrated in spain and which is quite different to the roman rite

and from the very fact that we have to consider different rights

uh and from the very fact that pope innocent iii said that you shouldn't change a pope

who changes all the rights and all the sacraments and comes up with new ones put himself in schism with the church

and the very fact that the council of trent seventh session of the council of trent

about sacraments in general canon 13 says whatsoever says

that the traditionally handed down rights that are

used in the solemn administration of sacraments can be held in disdain or can be

shortened or can be turned into new rights by any one of the pastors of the church

anyone this means whosoever because the latin word chris kumquat doesn't mean anyone but it means

whosoever doesn't matter who it is he can't do it now whosoever means the pope is included who says so is outside the

church that's why i think that the pope doesn't have a right

to change all the rights if he does so at the least he is committing a schismatic

act because that's against the unity of the church and i mean just look around there is no such thing as unity anymore

here everyone does what he wants what do you do with the right that you recognize not

being the latin roman right as such when you consider its validity now for

the roman rite we have a definition for the roman rite the sacramental forms

and the matters are defined we know if we don't use bread and wine

for mass it can't be mass anyway you don't use water for baptism but coca-cola it can't be

baptism anyway we we know these things we also know if you if you baptize in the name of christ

which pope nicholas the first said would be valid we know it's not valid in any case it

has to be in the name of the father son holy spirit trinitarian baptism

uh at the same time when we are faced with a schismatic right which is something the church had to deal with

extensively and intensively latest after the great schism between the eastern the western

churches in the year 1054 the church had to deal

with the question how do we determine which right is valid

so they went according to the content that means they examined the form

of the sacrament and said does this form express the essentials of the

sacrament yes or no they didn't say

is this form deviating in one or two or three single terms or words

from what they are supposed to do no they examine those rights according to

does it express the essence of the sacrament yes or no the last one to make

these things very sure was probably the 13th in upper story at the end of the last

century when he established that the anglican ordinations were not valid and he established finally and forever

that they were not valid mainly because of the defect of intention not of the form originally of the form

but not back then and so when you deal with the the

question are the novus order sacraments valid you have to examine the matter the form and the official

mind you and that's the whole point the official intention the objective intention the manifest intention

the church has never tried to look into one's soul you can't even do that in the confessional how would i know as a

priest if the guy who's just confessing his sins is saying the truth or not i can only i can only pronounce the

judgment on what i've heard god knows his soul the fact that saint john maria

villani knew it was a special gift another one of these aforementioned uh grazie gratis data the freely given

gifts and according to that we have to face the fact that in latin

the word the fact that they leave out mysterium v day mystery of the faith is not a change

in the essences of mass the essence of mass is the double consecration it's very important to understand the

essence of mass is the double consecration twin it should be called twin consecration

bread and wine therefore the essence and this is something you can look up in the old moral theologies is this is my bread

this is the crop of my of my blood uh this is i'm sorry uh this is my body and this is the cup

of my blood that's the essence and that is given in the latin

new riot the question starts with the vernacular translations

that change the actual message of those words by saying which has been

given for all instead of for many

those who expect father has to be the judge on everything will be highly disappointed when i tell them i do not have definite proof that new

mass in english is invalid i also do not have definite proof that

the new masses in english is valid therefore i have proof

that it is doubtful i have never had a doubt about the latin

lumas celebrate it correctly of course why correctly there is a big big big

great great important mistake about that people think they can judge a priest's

intentions no you can't but and this is how the church did it

and does it if a priest dressed in whatever the local investments are but

obviously those vestments that are used for mass

approaches an altar whatever that is as long as people would commonly say yes

that's an altar has the missile up there uses the

official book issued by the church issued i said because when we talk about the novice

order we're not talking about a promulgated law issued booked by the church

then it would say okay father is going to say mass you see again i talked about the common sense on another occasion

and i have to repeat it common sense is the sense for the problem you see that somebody has this makes it

visible that he has the intention of doing what the church does it's like

when you have a priest of the society of saint christ the tenth he leaves the sacristy

he is dressed as a priest supposed to dress he approaches an altar that looks like

an altar is supposed to look like on that altar there is a missile which you of course can only presume

they're not going to let you see it to check but you presume this missile up there is a real authentic missile of

saint paul is the fifth therefore a missile of the catholic church roman latin right and then he starts uh nominee patrick's

defeated spiritual sanctions you presume okay father's same as

and that's very important because this way the priest makes it manifest manifest means visible

almost tangible if you were allowed to that he's saying mass

therefore if a priest in the in the new right performs the way he's supposed to

your your point of departure will be the presumption that he wants to do what the church does not saying this is

always the case there is some people out there in this country who take everything that i say

and say then they say the country said okay father so you did not say that

that's i'm sorry uh human language is not that simple or simplistic

after having been in huge european palaces if i say to you john this is a beautiful house and it's

a beautiful house but i've been in bigger houses than this one here uh some of these

theologians so-called theologian would say okay father so you're saying this is a small house

no i didn't say that i said i've been to bigger ones

i didn't say i've been this is a small house and it's not a small house

i don't consider this a small house but i've been to bigger ones see this is no way of arguing theology

in theology you do not never ever try to hook somebody else to his own

quotation real theology the way saint thomas dealt

with it the way most of the greatest theologians did

you only want to find out the truth you're not interested in what the other one says

this is why i say you don't listen to me hopefully if i don't make a mistake i'm not infallible if i don't make a

mistake hopefully you're listening to what the probes say but you don't listen to what i say you

listen to what the popes said minors the faults of my memory

now wait the point i'm making here is we're talking about probability

i consider the new mass properly celebrated in latin or in a correct translation

which for example in the polish language is correctly translated i consider it

as much as i have the authority to judge on that i consider it valid if you if you say

there is the general instruction to the new mass which delivers a heretical definition of mass

i'm sorry to disappoint you on this point it does but that is the rubrics

officially officially and you have to read apostolic chikura the document on

the anglican ordinations on that where pope leo 13th says if

the if the right is shortened if things are left out with the obvious intention of

changing the doctrine and the doctrine is changed then it's invalid

on paper officially ask the vatican write a letter to partner ratzinger officially on paper the church is

steadfastly holding to the real presence the sacrifice of mass and the priesthood

in practice in real life they don't but on paper they i i

now come back to you but excuse me there's one thing that i

finally have to add these are my viewpoints

this doesn't change the fact that i consider the new mass as such doubtful and that of course puts it in a

different light then singer in meta quotation 2101

says you're not allowed to frequent sacraments not even for possible reasons according to a probability

another question i have is

do you believe and this is a question just asked of me since uh i set you up with that talking about

the validity of the mass yeah if you if you felt that the the

sacraments of vatican ii were doubtful

would you not try to have yourself reordained

because you may have not been ordained correctly yes definitely yes to that but i don't doubt

them say uh you talk about the sacraments there are seven

as long as one follows the newly published write on baptism

i'm i'm only aware of the latin edition so uh those people who always like to

hook me on my own arguments uh don't quote me on the vernacular editions thank you

i'm talking about latin i have no doubt about baptism even though there's the exorcism is a

libido um i have no doubt about confession

especially not about confession all that's needed for confessions able to absorb applications

in what language language ever as long as it's really understood i have absolutely no doubt about

ordination whatsoever i will go into detail about this obviously but before you go that far

yeah uh malachi martin who was of course someone you sort of liked uh in his i think was

deserted vineyard said we don't know at this point who is

really truly ordained yes correct that has a different background this thing which i will i i will come back to

now when we talk about the new sacraments i said um if uh if the intention is manifested the

priest is going to celebrate mass see i'm not quoting myself here i'm

quoting a person that i consider to be a real authority on this and uh

quite frankly i don't care if people agree with me on this point archbishop lefevre said basically

speaking the new sacraments are valid unless and then he made the exception that i

will go into detail with but he said basically speaking it's valid and archbishop lefevre said that

uh as a point of departure we considered the new mass valley unless and then he uh said

pretty similar things to what i had said and i consider archbishop lefevre an

authority i do not consider 17 year old self-appointed theologians

who are not even the priesthood have never studied properly in anything to be authorities i do not even consider

myself to be that much of an authority but archbishop lefebvre according to a

church tradition when uh things get rough so so speaking you trust the bishop rather than the

priest basically speaking now this could be turned beautifully against me with the american bishops conference

today but at the same time would say we'll look at the priesthood mores and the point i'm making is

we are dependent on a certain authority on many things because even papal statements are anything but clear

at least sometimes and as far as the probability is concerned i

excluded i have a problem with confirmation

because i don't think that paul vi could validly allow anything but olive oil to be used

for confirmation which is the matter of confirmation and therefore if you go ahead and use

some peanut oil or sunflower oil or whatever

i consider i consider confirmation invalid however i'm not a pope and i

have no final judgment on it i i consider it it's definitely doubtful definitely from what we know it's

doubtful when we consider extreme function without olive oil i can't see how it

would work well now today the ordinations don't have extra i'm sorry

so i'm sorry the matter of the nation is the imposition of hands not the olive oil

now as far as the alienation is concerned paul the six i don't know about i i have

to be honest i did not i did not compare the old and the new right on the

ordination of of deacons jacqueline but i did only recently

with a friend of mine in austria who's a pretty aerodyne theologian we compared the forms of ordination of

the new and the old ordination to the priesthood and the consecration to for bishops

i know the argument that's looming in the background including sacramento arguments by pope 12.

if if the infallible document that popeye's

the 12th published under the title sacramento ordinance where he said that

them for validity the form of yakunit has to be colon such and such priesthood colon

such and such bishophood colon such and such

if that was applicable for all other nations we would have since then no valid

ordinations in the eastern rights mind you the united or the schismatic we

would have no valid ordinations in any right that doesn't correspond to the latin

roman right in this point obviously therefore the document the

past 12 published is regarding the roman latin the roman latin

right i said before what do you do if you're faced with a

right that you cannot properly uh categorize but obviously you have to judge it

according to content now politics claimed i have not checked up on it so that's another

one of these things a theologian who pretends that he will be able to answer everything correctly in the public

discussion is not a man who wants the truth but is a man who wants to be right

beware of people who want to be right all the time i have been wrong more often

on more things than you than in theology than you ever knew that could be right or wrong i

can if i if i started to give you an account on everything that i have been wrong about in the old days especially in theology

we'd be sitting here for another six hours with another three tapes all right i have i'm i'm talking i'm

talking about the episcopal ordination see with the priesthood ordination there

has been one word different ut the conditional word

in is not necessarily conditional word in latin

according to all traditional moral theologies i've ever read

even when an infallible papal decree defines

that for the validity of a sacrament the form has to be such and such and

such if a non-essential word is left out

that does not significantly change the sense of these words even according

to the rather strict rubrics in the old myth that talk about the possible defects while celebrating mass

would consider it sinful if it's done deliberately but would consider it valid

that means that even from the viewpoint of the latin roman right priesthood ordination

cannot be considered invalid and the bishop who ordained me a priest by the

way was consecrated in the alt-right in 1965. archbishop solatani that the thing that

concerns us here is are the bishops that are ordained in the

novus order consecration right valid bishops again

under the condition that all the other necessary conditions are fulfilled

the form is definitely valid policy exclaims and i said before i have not

checked up on that but politics claims that he took that form from the byzantine right

i don't care the point is there is several different ways of consecrating validly a

bishop now the the church in rome has cons has always considered

all the seven sacraments with the schismatic heretical russian orthodox and greek

orthodox churches valid if you bother to read translations of

the episcopal consecration and the priesthood alienation in the eastern riots you'd be surprised what you find

it's not clear at all as a matter of fact i can tell you one thing as i had to deal with this recently i

compared the uh episcopal consecration on the pastor 12

the set in his uh sacramento ardennes with the new one

and the funny thing i found was the the old episcopal consecration form is

not as clear about the uh actual role of a bishop as the german translation of the new one

so we're talking we're talking about something that is contained in the form

of the sacrament and as i said before as i cannot

consider the new ordinations to be necessarily of the latin roman right uh

leave it open right now if the novus ordo is just plainly schismatic or if

it's agnostic sec as bishop this race or if it's just a

conciliar sect as archbishop le favor called it if it's let's say it's sectarian and

heretical then we have to deal with it exactly the way the church dealt with the russian orthodox and the greek

orthodox rights which are all recognized all of them and they're not necessarily

as clear as the lowest order rights on many things but i i have not yet found the

theologian who will definitely prove to me that the new episcopal consecration misses out on the essences of bishophood

the old one is anything but clear for the simple reason we have we are

facing a phenomenon here which is quite amazing when you read the old code of canon law

the 1917 code of canal is something that some people in this country always love to quote against me in my face

well we have a problem there because in the quote of canon law of 1917 it

says that the major orders are yakima yakunato priesthood

pastor 12 said it's jacob priesthood and bishop

saint thomas aquinas said and it was a tradition in the latin church that the

matter of ordination at priesthood is the handing over of the instruments

which had to be while the bishop was still holding them chalice and patton

had to be touched by the uh candidate for ordination i mean guess

what the massive ceremony at my ordination insisted that i do it that you must touch it he said you must touch it

he was obviously not all too aware of the sacramento holiness decreed by pastor 12

who said no the matter is definitely the imposition of hands because with the greek united for

example you never had the handing over the instruments logical clear to last point however

canon law doesn't define things and never has defined things and some people ought to get this in

their head it's the purpose of papal magisterium to define things not a catalog all right i have i have

another one

can a priest are a religious bishop archbishop cardinal pope

be a nation nope what if he is according to the old code

of canon law he's excommunicated according to the new code of canada he has to be just justly punished

that's what the law says question who consecrated the fate

excuse me who consecrated the faith that's bishop uh cardinal leonard

i'm getting someone asked me the question or told me that that person or that bishop

archbishop was a mason that's going around yeah i know apart from the fact that

uh it's not it's not that easy to produce proof for the fact that cardinal leonard was amazed

if he weren't supposition that's what i'm saying as uh it's not the purpose of this

conversation here to clear up uh the rather insignificant detail if uh archbishop cardinal leonard

of leon was a mason or not if he was a mason then i would suggest

to that person who suggested that archbishop lefevre might not have been consecrated the bishop validly

to read up to check up on the right of ordination which demands that it has to be three

bishops and all the three bishops have to consecrate all the three

bishops have to have the intention of consecrating all the three bishops have to impose

their hands therefore if that person is able to

prove to me that all the three bishops who consecrated archbishop lefevre

were most definitely masons then i would say ha that's too bad that means that

archbishop lefevre has been illegally consecrated but validly

no one oh yes well you always get people who would suggest any kind of things but

the church has never said that one who is excommunicated cannot ordain

see only a sacrament that in its validity as to its validity is

dependent only saity on being allowed

is doubtful in that case not a sacrament that doesn't depend on it

so so your answer to to them would be that there had to be three bishops that's not

the point the point is not only there had to be three bishops there was three bishops who consecrated

archbishop of favor but also if all the three of them had been missiles which is not easily to establish

uh not easily established even if that had been the case he would have been validly consecrated

because the fact that you're excommunicated means you don't have your office if archbishop leonard which i am not as

sure about i i don't believe that if i buy at the local cash register if you if i buy one

of those black and white it is it's still black and white i think uh newspapers that tell me that a b17

bomber fleet has to be had been found on the moon and that adolf hitler was a woman i

usually don't waste my time to check up on these things and i have longer though stopped to

check on every mason that i supposedly you're saying before and even if someone were excommunicated

he ordains validly okay all right um

have you ever heard of a group called the knights of malta yes definitely and who are they are they

part of what what are they part of there are several theories there is a very interesting uh there's a very interesting group in

[Music] i think it's pennsylvania it's in pennsylvania yes

who claim to be the the true knights of malta and who say that the knights of mata

right now in rome would not be the red knights of malta

their argument is that when the order of the knights of

malta sort of sort of diet with the grandmasters was it treason or whatever i don't

remember my memory for historical details is unfortunately not good

they claimed there had been a sort of serious vacancy among the the grand masters of the

knights of malta and then leo the 13th re-established the knight order of malta they say that

can't be because if it is actually as the italian license plate says s-m-o-m small

sovereign military already sovereign military order of malta it wouldn't be

sovereign if it's out of papal graces now they say that uh because uh

the the roman knights of malta are dependent on paper grace they are not sovereign and they can't be the true

knights of malta and then they i've never been able however to find detailed informations on

who after czar which were which star was paul paul i think it was paul who supposedly

was the last grandmaster of the two knights of malta how that succession would end up within

in chicago pennsylvania i don't the point no excuse me the point i'm making is this

i couldn't care less if the knights of malta and rome are authentic or not i know they are not catholics because

they follow everything that vatican do says in the process well i don't think that was the the

intent of the other question i think the intent of the question is that there are a lot of subversive

secret societies of malta has never been secret okay never

none of those groups not that i'm aware of

there is oh you want a secret society try to find out the membership of other

members in the opus dei

the escriva testimonies

excuse me uh the escriva witnesses that language mistake bait the jehovah

witnesses the escrima witnesses trying to find out a full membership list of the escriva witnesses

jose marie escribati balaguer the founder of the opus evidently do you think there's something

subversive with them or yes definitely can you expand on that yes

[Music] the founder of the opus dei who supposedly is gratified at the time

when pius xii i believe that pastor 12 was pope and was able to do it

in 1949 put the membership in the party in the communist party under excommunication

and also at the same time put under excommunication any work done for the communist party

the founder of the opus dei and this is something that the opus dei confirms in at least one of their

publications accepted members of the spanish communist or italian

already i don't remember that but communist party into the opal state and when one of those communists that's

a dialogue i read in one of the opus state publications when one of these opposed i'm sorry when

one of these party members of the communist party said to the founder of the opu state but

monsignor in that case i would have to leave the communist party the founder of the opus dei said oh no

there will be no need for that so what do you make of that what do you

call that when the membership in the communist party was under excommunication

the founder of the oprah state admitted members of the communist party into the opal state without telling them to leave

the communist party can you beatify a man who was in public disobedience against the pope

at the time mind you when there was no church crisis like now

by the way uh the founder of the opus dei said that he had a doctorate in not only in theology but also canon law

i've never found anybody who would show me that people have asked the opus dei to

produce the document there's no answer i'm not saying

i'm just saying i would like to see it in your uh one of your tapes

uh you spoke of martin luther yeah now i have heard that someday he may be

a catholic saint right in fact years ago

someone got a picture down to i need a gulf wine for that

[Music] you spoke about martin luther and you

you felt he was a very evil man

he said things 10 books and publishers

thomas a nelson ten books and publishers have an excellent book the title is i don't

remember the author but ten books uh requires a title a number or an author and they will be able to ship the book

to you in ten books you will find facts

about luther read the book

luther used names for our lord that i refuse to repeat

and luther admitted freely that he had his inspirations from the devil

do we need more

you ready yeah there is a picture of the pope

kissing the quran yes public act of apostasy and he calls it a

holy book it's public act of apostasy if it if i had scientifically irrefutable

proof that that act of apostasy would be a formal act of apostasy

i would side with the citizens vacantist

there's no doubt that he kissed the correct yeah there's no doubt is there any doubt that he called it a holy book nope

how do you make that extension that he was a formal heretic people who

have studied recent american history a witness to the fact that a president can say a lot of

nonsense does he cease to be president

i know the argument is the president doesn't lose his office by being a heretic

in the church you lose your office by being a heretic i would say if you can lose your office

by by being treasonous that's an excellent argument uh

it's a virtue he subverts the government what would be the difference in this

century the 20th century which will not which has not ended last december 31st

but will end uh december 31st for those who have a spark of

mathematics left in their memory because it was called the 20th century and the 20th century cannot

end in 1999. even if kaiser wilhelm that zweiter of germany

in 1900 decreed this to be the first year of the 20th century it doesn't change

the fact that the 20th century has given ample proof

for a treacherous b people being heads of states without losing their

office now the uh i that we we are here actually uh touching another

question which you might have in your list of questions i don't know but we're actually touching

another question here do we have a probe yes or no i have only one answer to this and i will repeatedly

give this answer as long as i do not have scientifically irrefutable proof

that this present pope is not pope i will hold him as such why

papal pronouncements on when a pope not just when somebody loses his

office but when a pope loses his office have been scarce to say the least

very few popes unfortunately because i do not believe it but very few popes have contradicted

the theory that the pope is above canon law mind you i'm quoting uh even judge

doctors forgive me i don't have the page i don't have the author i don't have the book

but uh it's an old saying the pope is above canelo

pope pius ix said about himself i am tradition

which is impossible but of course uh a mental error

is no impediment to sanctity however popeye's the ninth said i am tradition i

don't believe that i don't believe that a single pope can be traditional impossible the popes have unfortunately

been very very [Music] even contradictory on the on this

subject when the bishop of brixton

in 1869 asked the past the ninth

what will happen they were discussing the uh infallibility to be pronounced as a

dogma the plaster 9 was asked by the bishop of greeks what will happen if a future pope

was to pronounce heresy why is the knight didn't say he would

lose his office now this is in writing and you can find it in the famous collection of papal pronouncements or

papal private correspondence the collection is for those who like footnotes m-a-n-s-i

mike alpha november sierra india mansi and it's in the 5000 i wish i had a

better memory for things like this it's 5 500 something if i remember well

the quotation marks the ninth says oh you just don't follow him you don't

say this guy he loses his office he doesn't say he ceases to be broke he says okay but then

you just don't follow him just like saint thomas aquinas said if if your prelate is wrong you just can't

follow him but isn't there another document that that's that speaks of uh something like um

if the pope does something heretical he's no longer pope no no wait a second you can't do something heretical you can only

pronounce it pronounce something right uh but here's the point is the point is

cannonball presumes that you are a formal heritage that's canon law anyway

moral theology like primra for example or varens or vidal say that

discussing the topic discussing the issue of a pope losing his office say only if

he's in formal heresy that's uh we don't have the time here and we would have to go for five hours to discuss these arguments what i

have to say no no i'm i'm i'm i'm fully satisfying you because you you will see that this is this is

uh what you were asking that was not what i was asking no i'm sorry you said uh someone has

someone has brought up that yeah you evade an issue

that there is a document that says that when the pope uh

commits something uh heresy all right he is no longer pope ipso

facto no i didn't say that although i am saying there is a document to that yes right and people yeah

many there are many documents to this point okay saint robert bellamine who is at least a doctor of the church right

saint robert bellamine says even if the pope was to pronounce just material heresy he would ipso facto

cease to be pope okay why doesn't that hold the point i'm making is

there has been there have been so many contradicting theories on this

subject for example this uh even though i don't accept it it's there

and if i accept it or not it's not the point it's there the old saying that the pope is above

camel law if the pope is above kennel law you cannot apply canada law on him

who would do that anyway cannon 333 paragraph three of the nuclear cannon

law and that's an almost liberal copy from uh the relevant canon in the old canon law

says

there is no appeal against the roman pontiff so the old the oldest problem as to this

topic does the pope cease to be pope when he becomes a heretic the oldest

problem is not to determine is he a heretic or not but to determine if he's pope or not

who's going to do that you see this is the whole point archbishop lefevre again uh pronounced pretty well on this

subject he was asked of course you can't imagine the seminarians in econ they had the same problems

and they knew most of the arguments back and forth against and four and they asked him and he said

archbishop lefebvre said very clearly he said there they have excellent arguments there are very good

arguments to believe that he's not pope but when you consider canon law which

certainly applies to us obviously it's not that sure if it

applies uh pope but it certainly concerns us then you have to consider the fact that the pope

doesn't have to prove anything to us uh the onus propandy this is called latin

the burden of proof lies with us it might as well be and i firmly believe

i'm firmly convinced that the state of accountists have much better arguments for their viewpoint

than we have for upholding the pope they have much better arguments

but who's going to decide on that who's going to decide on that who

decided on the arguments for immaculate conception and against the immaculate conception

i don't believe it was a priest from vienna speaking to john mcfay in philadelphia you see the point is

i i have discussed this extensively with many theologians i have discussed

it with theologians who are really erudite i've also discussed it with theologians who especially on the telephone

try nothing else but to hook me up on my own lines by stating the contrary

i've discussed it with serious people and i've discussed it with less than serious people i do know

from my uh reading some certificates have gone through the

trouble of writing excellent usually theologically very eroding

thesis on this topic the very fact that i'm not convinced

is completely sufficient for my mentioning the pope in the canon because

even if i personally was convinced that he is not pope you think i'm stupid

if i mention john paul ii in the canon and at the last judgment i

find out he wasn't pope what is god gonna do to me nothing but what if i firmly believe

that he is not pope and i don't mention him in the canon anymore and then the last judgment i find out he was pope

oh oh the burden of proof is something of the of a very decisive

nature insensitive issues like that this is one of the reasons we we

discussed the validity of ordination the pope doesn't have to prove to me that i've been validly ordained

and i don't have to prove to you that i've been valid here at the end the other part has to produce the proof

the burden of proof doesn't lie with the one that is presumed to be right by the law

the burden of proof lies with the one who challenges it that's not just true in canon law it's

true in all logical civil laws

the pope for example i mean of course this is not this is not a conclusive argument if he

actually holds the office of being peter vicar of christ but the pope is recognized as a head of state by

by by a three-digit number of countries now the one who challenges that is the

one who has to present the proof if the president of the united states says okay now i'm going to appoint a new

ambassador to the vatican he doesn't have to produce proof that there is a head of state in the vatican

and he doesn't have to pre to produce proof that the vatican is a recognized state or that the catholic church is a

recognized institution some things are presumed and if you uh

do not follow the presumption you have to produce the proof now i say it again the set of accounts

do have the better arguments than we have but are they conclusive i don't think so

and even if they were conclusive who is going to establish bioauthority that this is the case

you ready for another one yeah this is mine good

when a person is beatified becomes a saint

uh verified or and then it also becomes the same okay declare the same

yeah yeah kind of nice can there be a mistake there

uh i have to be honest i do know the answer for beatification

beautification has never been considered infallible okay but okay the next step of course

canonization i have recently had the occasion to discuss this with one of my best friends

whom i consider a person more intelligent more erudite than i am

and he said that even when you read benedict xiv prospero lambertini

pope benedict xiv who most probably was one of the uh

most aerodyne most intelligent most educated popes in history who wrote the famous document the

biatification at the canonization about beatification of the blessed

and canonization of the the sanctity he decided on many of these issues

and even when you read his document it does not become fully clear if

canonization is to be considered infallible i i personally believe it's infallible

colonization i i cannot i cannot say look i'm talking i'm

talking to people who at least most people are going to watch this tape

usually have trust in my information and i don't want to disappoint them because

i don't have the right to do that that's why i underline the fact that i personally believe that canonization is infallible

but i'm open to facts you see i'm sometimes you face a fact

and then you see it it doesn't hold up why i bring this up

yes the ineffective ability of the church

may be questioned here yeah because if sainthood

um

there cannot be any mistakes yes it's still being canonized

i now bring up this to you we bring up john the 23rd and we bring

up pius the ninth ah yeah okay now uh basically aren't they contradictory no

yes definitely there are four yeah but that's two different questions here now the ineffectibility of the church

those who of you who have it already won't have to order it from 10 books but the

ineffectibility of the church is something that has been abused especially recently the concept

of indefectability 10 books and publishers offer also

an excellent english translation of the famous german book by ludwig ott the family name is spelled

oscar tango tango ot catholic dogma and

uh ludwig art is usually very reliable in quoting church doctrine

now the indefectability of the church doesn't mean that everything the church does is all right

ineffectibility like the unity of the church is basically the understanding that the

church is always one always true when you look at the creed it says udam sanctum catholicum

the one holy catholic and apostolic church that's the indefectability of the church

the greatest problem with infallibility is something that i will not sufficiently uh clear up uh in

this conversation because unfortunately that's not i just can't do it i'm not i'm i i i i don't make

that i i don't i don't cheat you i'm not gonna pretend i know the answer if i don't know the answer okay

and uh the the limits of infallibility

when does the magic magisterium become infallible when can you rely on the merchandise

what's the borderline between infallible and non-infallible it's something that

today is of a greater importance than ever

but that doesn't mean that it's cleared up the subject is not cleared up now coming back you you asked about

gratification empires tonight i will not disappoint you on this uh as far as canonization is concerned i

honestly do not know if canonization is to be considered

invalid i consider it invalid but i do not know that i cannot say this with

certitude i'm sure there will be some very intelligent people who will come up with quotations

the problem with quotations is you can contradict christ with the gospel

so careful with quotations especially with single quotations other contexts you

wanted to know repairs the ninth and john the 23rd here's my answer paris tonight yes john the 23rd 9th and

i can prove it i cannot prove to you that pious the 9th is a saint

how would i be able to i cannot prove that to you i believe it for one reason

what saint i beatified okay blessed uh i had the

privilege to know the promoter of the cause of pastor knight personally for

many years his name was monsignor antonio pioranti

in his quality canon of the basilica of saint peter's in rome

we met at least a hundred times in those years that our enrollment and

he was the is or was at least honestly i don't even know if he's still

alive but he was the promoter of the cause of pope pius the knight

when in 1979 he presented to me a medal of uh pious the ninth

that had been printed out of the lead coffin in which pious the ninth had rested before

uh his body was recovered for the examination for the uh cause at the congregation for the

cause of the saints he told me that basically now we're talking about 79.

john paul ii was pope for one year and had not yet had a chance to change all the rules and regulation

of how how to become a saint okay so that's important to remember and back

then in 79 uh monsignor antonio piolanti told me that everything is ready for the

beautification of paris tonight so we are talking about facts that date

back to a time before the president pope changed procedures

now as this doesn't mean that that's not a proof that pius knight is definitely blessed

i believe it and i venerate him and i celebrated mass in his honor but as far as john the 23rd is concerned

the case is easy remember what i said about the founder of the opus dei and

decree against communism okay now in the 1950s when paul passed the 12th was

pope uh angelo giuseppe roncalli the later

john the 23rd became after he had been nunzio in paris he became patriarch of venice archbishop

patriarch of venice when he was patriot of venice that's a famous case that you can find in all the

archives and it was all over the newspapers back then he sided with the local

communist union just issue or not is not the point here cited with the

local communist union against the italian state and

one of his famous uh what do you call them the pastoral letters that are issued for

lent he had to take it back because pisces

cloth angrily grabbed his white telephone and called him and said take it back

he did that but he still sided with the communists against the italian government now this

in a time when the decree that he later on as pope confirmed

was still valid you cannot beatify a man like this i'm sorry because there's rules

we are not talking this is one thing that has to be understood beatification or canonization

mean that the man is in heaven but beatification but the failure

to beatify or to sancti or to canonize a person does not mean he's not in heaven

so i'm not discussing that i'm coming to this point

it seems to me that someone is trying to make john the 23rd a saint and if he does and they put it in with

pius ix they'd be both become saints and the

other contradictory yes of course doctrinally at least not

character wise no but doctrinally well of course pius ix was not a liar john the 23rd was there is a famous case

that will soon be dealt with uh scientifically in a publication i wish

i could give you uh the publisher and the the footnote and but i'm not allowed

to at this point because it hasn't been published yet by them and we're not talking about the fatima crusader where i'm personal friends

with father gruner and the publishers but we're talking about somebody uh that i have no right to quote here before the

publication is actually out but the case of john the 23rd will be dealt with individually

and in detail now there was this famous uh encyclical john the 23rd in favor of the

latin language and when a few of the liberals

whose names we know again father has memory is not what you think so

i don't remember the the name i don't even remember the title of the document but what i'm indicating to you here is this

is a conversation not a scientific proof for everything i say uh pope john xxiii had published that

decree on latin actually it's not a decrees and encyclical in favor of latin so some liberals

confronted him with that they were not alone it was other cardinals present

john xxiii told them don't worry about it i had to do that means it was for the show

can you beautify a person like that that's my problem with defectibility

correct and the problem with defectibility is simply because of a wrong definition of defectibility

the church has been jam-packed with idiots for two thousand years do you think there are people who were saints that were really not saints

quite possibly one of the reasons why i think that everyone who has been canonized

is in heaven is because

the declaration that somebody is saying might not be true as to his virtues to his life

to the example he gave but why wouldn't the pope be able to use his keys

for the person as such he's got the keys yeah come back to you

on this that's not a doctrine that's a theory actually it's a suspicion

it's not evil the american church is trying to tell everyone that vatican ii

was a godsend to the church um maybe as a punisher now who started john

who started vatican 2 john the 23rd now if he's made a saint

could it be vatican 2 was wrong yes well that's the issue well that's no

contradiction anyway not even the old days uh is center brochures a saint

yes saint ambrosius the judge father senator brochus said that if a heretic who has been baptized

in the name of christ converts he doesn't have to be re-baptized

saint ambrosius said that that's nonsense it's baloney

why well who said that a saint cannot pronounce bologna or do baloney i i'm saying that it seems to me

they're trying to authenticate vatican ii by making john the 23rd correct because just like everybody else

almost everybody else today infallibility is the fashionable era of the century

uh there was a priest his name was abby abby is the title monsieur b reverend

father le fox f-o-q-u-e

french he was director of the seminary of the french

seminary in rome when a certain young seminarian called marcel

lefebvre attended the french seminary in rome uh missile baylor fox said

in we're talking about the 20s now that saint pius 10th

has uncovered and dealt with the modernists we are facing the worst of all heresies

the heresy that the pope can't do anything

even if pastor knight said i am tradition now pastor knight was a

joker if you read a detailed biography of pious tonight which i have bothered to do 30 years ago

first time you will find out that saint paul's uh i'm sorry excuse me uh a blessed pious the ninth

was a man of great humor and just like father has on these tapes

uh blessed pious ninth would not always say something that's immediately to be taken this

infallible statement or doctrine because when pius ix uh talked as a

regular normal human being he was exactly as infallible as i am

silch zero nada nothing niente and uh so i'm i'm not i'm not

contrary to some people whose tactic it is all the time to do that i'm not going to hook past the ninth on

his statement i am tradition it's a very dangerous statement but then i have uh

other more dangerous statements pastor depressed the knight twice tonight twice the ninth said

when you uh you talk about infillability

he not only said if a pope was to pronounce heresy you just don't follow him

if you look up then signature and mezzo you will find uh dan singer then single

number uh 3050 following up to 3070 something you will find the

solemn dogma of infallibility after that in the dancing collection you will find

a document that had been written by the german bishops conference because the german reich's cancer the rice

chancellor bismarck challenged that dogma on totally absurd grounds

so the german bishops got together in those days they were catholic the german bishops got together and came

up with the document explaining papal infallibility popeyes the knight saw the document read the document and

signed it so it's his and in that document listen to the terminology of pope pius x now

this document originally is in german so i'm i'm not uh i i read latin as i

read german but i grew up with german the document doesn't say

it explains that bismarck said uh does that mean the infallibility that now the pope is the bishop of

berlin and the bishop of dresden and the bishop of cologne the bishop of munich

of which some people today seem to believe but uh the palestinians just

had the german bishops answer it by saying no if for some reason the bishop of berlin

does not take care of his diocese the pope and mine mind you this is a

literal translation i'm giving you if the bishop of berlin for some reason

doesn't mind the business of his doesn't take care of the business of his diocese

and now comes the literal reputation the pope has to interfere

look at the word he has you find it twice in the same paragraph

that means the german bishops didn't say if for some reason the bishop of so-and-so and such and such

does not take care of his diocese it's in the uh judgment of the pope if he will do

something about it or not they didn't they didn't say that they said the pope has to react

the pope has to interfere twice in one paragraph he has to do it and pause the ninth

signed it christ the knight did nothing else but what his predecessors did

who believed in the old oath of coronation vapor coronation that was an oath the

last time was signed by the predecessor forgot who it was upon pope bonifaciously who became pope in

1302 he was signed uninterruptedly by 600 years of papacy

between pascalis the first and uh bonifaciously confessed the eighth and

that uh oath of incarnation says that he swears he won't change anything that has been handed down from his predecessors

what was that changed it

oh because that was just a guarantee of orthodoxy to the holy roman emperor and the kings and that's why after

bonifacio didn't sign it it doesn't mean that it's out of out of

how you say that it has been that's a piece of the past if 600 years for 600 years all the pope

signed it that means it's something accepted in church tradition there's no need to talk signs

it you ought to know it we know that the present book doesn't know it but uh he ought to know it the point i'm making

is papal infallibility what does it mean penguin vulnerability

i wish i could give you a sufficiently detailed answer because the available quotations will

not even the dogma is such because the dogma

for example in 3070 says the holy spirit has not given the success had not been given to the

successes of peter that with his revelation they will pronounce a new doctrine

[Music] but that with his assistance they will

uh faithfully ex saintly guard and faithfully explain

the handed down tradition from the [Music]

applause [Music]

here [Music]

so you